[jswaykos]

What's the deal with cigar (and humidor) pricing?! On almost every site I'll see an absurdly high MSRP, and then a really low sale price.

For example, take this week's CI special. 20 Gurkha Cuban Legacy Toros for $35. MSRP is $110. The normal selling price of these cigars on the site is $45. What gives?

Is MSRP what I'd expect to pay in a B&M shop? It seems that most online retailers (at least the bigger ones mentioned frequently in this forum) have similar pricing WELL under MSRP. Surely, this is just some marketing gimmick, right? I know all these cigars can't be deals of a lifetime, but for now my only barometer of good vs. not so good is price (with the knowledge that expensive doesn't guarantee best... but also with the knowledge that a $0.75 cigar is probably not as good as one selling for $8, personal preferences aside).

 

[Max_Power]

Something I've noticed is that cigars made specifically to sell at certain catalogs or sites, will usually have a very high msrp and then be sold much cheaper. If you look at other brands that are sold elsewhere, the msrp & selling price will be much closer to each other.

 

[Mutombo]

Gurkha in particular is notorious for having massively inflated MSRP's and low selling prices. One of the reasons the brand gets so much hate on these boards.

 

[Wigwam_Motel]

Been on boards for last 3 years, an realized that most people on the boards have no clue on how this business is; any msrp is almost a 100% mark up, then retailer push that bs about "tobacco tax" when it's is already included in the final price of the box, marked up even more plus local tax, it's insane. For example, J21 tat on invoice WITH California tax is about $140 or LFD DL lancero with California tax $75.00; Tat's are high ends, an a brand like Gurkha not so , I am sure for entire box is costing the retailer with tobacco tax very cheap. CI is big; if they buy 100 boxes from Gurkha, they may get XX amount of boxs free, or buy at a bulk discount.

 

[Mr. Slick]

The whole MSRP vs actual price is pretty screwy with online cigar vendors! It's like the old used car salesman trick- jack up the price by $5000 then offer a $3000 discount & the unsuspecting sucker ahem I mean customer thinks they are getting a deal. They do a lot of wheeling & dealing to create the illusion of a good deal.

If you look at Ci's big list of brands and click on Gurkha symphony, they sell 6 cigars for $36 & 18 cigars for $79.95. Thats $6 & $4.44 per stick respectively. But if you click on Gurkhagorgefest they have a 5 pack of these for $15 that's $3 Ea. Go figure- their screwy marketing ploys.

 

[jswaykos]

Been on boards for last 3 years, an realized that most people on the boards have no clue on how this business is; any msrp is almost a 100% mark up, then retailer push that bs about "tobacco tax" when it's is already included in the final price of the box, marked up even more plus local tax, it's insane. For example, J21 tat on invoice WITH California tax is about $140 or LFD DL lancero with California tax $75.00; Tat's are high ends, an a brand like Gurkha not so , I am sure for entire box is costing the retailer with tobacco tax very cheap. CI is big; if they buy 100 boxes from Gurkha, they may get XX amount of boxs free, or buy at a bulk discount.

I figured that the sheer volume that the online retailers are able to purchase is a major reason for drastically lower prices.

My other hobby is baseball cards. If you're remotely familiar with it, the guide to card values (Beckett) states what a card is worth. However, a card NEVER sells for book value, as it's some absurdly high, often times arbitrary number that is never reached. So when you go into a hobby shop, you'll find a card selling for $10, but the shop will proclaim it's "half off book value!!".

I kinda figured it's the same thing happening here. Nobody really ever pays the full MSRP, unless you have ZERO clue about what you're doing and are getting your smokes from a liquor store.

 

[jswaykos]

The whole MSRP vs actual price is pretty screwy with online cigar vendors! It's like the old used car salesman trick- jack up the price by $5000 then offer a $3000 discount & the unsuspecting sucker ahem I mean customer thinks they are getting a deal. They do a lot of wheeling & dealing to create the illusion of a good deal.

If you look at Ci's big list of brands and click on Gurkha symphony, they sell 6 cigars for $36 & 18 cigars for $79.95. Thats $6 & $4.44 per stick respectively. But if you click on Gurkhagorgefest they have a 5 pack of these for $15 that's $3 Ea. Go figure- their screwy marketing ploys.

It seems that if you're serious enough to be shopping for cigars online, common sense tells you to totally disregard the MSRP. Guess it comes down to paying what you're comfortable paying for a cigar you enjoy, and comparing specials against the normal selling price through whatever vendor you're using.

 

[asmartbull]

I have found that if you establish a good relationship with a local B&M, you can get great prices on Boxes. It just takes some time....

 

[rob51461]

Just like anything out there, MSRP is set by the manufacturer. Is it a sales gimmick?? Depends on whos selling it and what price they are paying. My local B&M is right there on the MSRP while most "online" vendors like CI that purchase a container of cigars compared to boxes like the B&Ms they can discount heavily for volume sales. I picked up a 10 pack of Graycliff Double Espresso for 40 bucks, the same single sells for 25 bucks at my local B&M. Its good business thats all.

 

[Batista30]

From my experiences online, cigars that are mass produced in ridiculous numbers or brands that continously come out with new cigars all the time(think RP or Gurkha) will have MSRPs that are based upon their own imagination. If you take specific brands (Padron, Arturo Fuente) you will notice that discounts may be minimal. I feel this is because the quality sells the cigar and they have no large need to always discount. They may minimize production to assure their product is not overstocked but rather selling consistently so spikes are avoided. The rule I try to abide by is to NEVER purchase a cigar at MSRP unless you absolutely know that they are a quality cigar that never discounts and/or a limited edition(small production). This has saved me quite a few dollars.

 

[Wigwam_Motel]

Nobody really ever pays the full MSRP, unless you have ZERO clue about what you're doing and are getting your smokes from a liquor store.

If you have ever had a cigar in a cigar lounge or bought a cigar in a cigar shop, esp around california; then you can bending over msrp; an each an every shop owner has they're b/s excuse. I remember talking to a major rep; he said, only reason they set certain prices is because they want to see if its hold to market. If it holds, they'll continue pushing it at that price. Fuente, short stories, anyone remember the price of these things in the 90's? early 2000? same thing is going on. Big tobacco says they had higher state tobacco tax, but they actually are enjoying the ride, increasing the per stick price of they're product, an just like tobacco tax went down in state of california, an shops did not lower they're prices because of the 12% or so, decrease, they kept prices the same or increased. There are certain cigars that sell over msrp any day of the week; opus for one. First box I ever box, was a box of RP vintage at a shop $320 handful of years back; now I can find them for $70 on a good day. Live an learn, I got burnt once; never again.

 

[Wigwam_Motel]

Here is one wholesell list you can look at; fyi not all prices on there are rock bottom (maybe they are not direct) but other prices are pretty much, an they are selling that to shops; now think about how much they are buying these boxes for before selling them to shops.I figure a 10 to 12% margin..

House of Oxford Cigars

 

[ghe-cl]

When evaluating cigar prices online, you should always bear in mind that two of the largest retailers are owned by major cigar makers: Altadis owns JR and Swedish Match (General) owns Cigars International.

 

[BKDW]

I have learned there is a lot of BSing when it comes to pricing.

B&Ms here in NYC are actually a good way to gauge how much you can actually get a cigar for. I have a basic rule: Take whatever their asking price is and divide it by either 2 or 3. That will give you the price you should be able to get it for if you really look.

I was just talking about RP....many of his cigars cost 12 bucks here. Divide that by 3, you get 4 dollars.

See, it works!


P.S. When I am in really "fancy" (meaning lots of BS) cigar lounges, I sometimes use the rule of 4 or 5.

 

[jswaykos]

It just all confused me a bit when I started looking at online cigar retailers. I've purchased bundles before from 'local', house blend places at cheap prices, but on every other occasion I've simply gone in to a B&M and picked one or two out that looked nice. They've always been in the $8-$12 range. While cigar smoking is something I truly enjoy, I'd always figured it was too expensive a hobby to ever dive in to.

Now, it can very certainly GET expensive, but you don't have to break the bank to get quality, enjoyable cigars... so long as you avoid B&Ms. But there's a premium to be paid for using their lounge and relaxing with buddies over a beer, I suppose, not that that couldn't be done at someone's house.

 

[BKDW]

First box I ever box, was a box of RP vintage at a shop $320 handful of years back.

:jaw: :shocked: :twitch: :bawling:

Only if had 320 bucks to spend on cigars right now.....

 

[Scott W.]

One word guys: MARKETING!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[thegoldenmackid]

There are two prices...

Wholesale prices (what B&Ms pay) and Distributor prices (what mail-ins pay). MSRP is normally keystoned (i.e. x2) of what the former is. The distributors not only pay less for most cigars, but also operate on different margins (usually 15-30%, instead of 50%) hence the confusion.

Now the other problem is taxes. A retailer in MN and a retailer in FL might pay the same for cigar X, but the retailer in MN has to add on tobacco tax whereas the FL retailer doesn't.

With the exception of JR's, the major mail-ins (CI/Cigar.com/CBID, Famous, Holt's, Thompson) are all based in FL or PA where there are no state tobacco taxes.

 

[thebayratt]

One word guys: MARKETING!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It seems that if you're serious enough to be shopping for cigars online, common sense tells you to totally disregard the MSRP. Guess it comes down to paying what you're comfortable paying for a cigar you enjoy, and comparing specials against the normal selling price through whatever vendor you're using.

Well put.

MSRP is Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price.
Key word:SUGGESTED; doesn't mean you have to sell it a $X.xx , but thats what the manufacturer would like to see them sold at.
Its all a gimmick for the seller, "Hey, look at this "Deal"!!!!" You bet you bottom dollar, they aren't loosing money.

If CI has a Gurkha cigar thats a CI exclusive, CI can tell Gurkha "make us a cigar, we will buy them @ $25/box, we will sell for $45/box, and make the MSRP $110 (for us {CI})."

Then they are not lying......... just not completely honest!